Sherlock Holmes Consulting Detective: Discussion

0:10 viewer discretion is advised hey everyone and welcome to the discussion for sherlock holmes consulting detective uh this is gonna encompass really all of them they're they all follow the same because it's sherlock holmes uh so the first thing i want to get out of the way is this is one of the very first uh games that came out in this genre i think there was a game called scotland yards specifically that came out uh earlier i have not played that one but this was they had a earlier version of the the baker's not the baker's three the regulars the um thames and other murder cases the very the brown box there was a uh previous box like by yatari which is now now it's under i think space cowboys does these um so this was one of the very first kind of whodunit uh cooperative you know solid case kind of thing you know first you have a case we know the case we know the answers now if we did this anytime soon we'd know the answers right um and uh very first thing i gotta i gotta say is this game is definitely not for everyone it is a majority of reading it is there's very little actually doing stuff like the map is really more aesthetics yeah and although it did give us a clue in this case it did give us yes yes the maps are actually is actually useful if you want to take the time to look at it every everything is useful yeah um but this is kind of more on that

1:40 verge of the debate of this is a game or is this an activity um yeah i'd probably say this is more of an activity is it obviously not an activity no people throw a huge [ __ ] fit about about the team yeah it's actually a huge thing of what what constitutes a game versus an activity i don't really delineate that but this one is you are sitting around reading to each other um and thinking and thinking with that being said while i would play chronicles of crime detective modern crime board game detective uh city of angels while i'd play all those before this one because this one kind of is dated and we'll talk about that a little bit um i still think that these are fantastic it like because after we have played those many more times that we actually came back to this one yeah this still holds up the cases are always solid they're never done in a way kind of like in like you reading you're like oh this is so obvious like what kind of our run through was and it's like oh god we were like not even [ __ ] close um how to have the wind knocked out of your sails one-on-one yeah pretty much which also can be it could be demoralizing if you want because there's really no difficulty level right like you think oh case one this is gonna be easy no yeah not really uh because in all those other games it gives you a difficulty level like on on the cases to where so you kind of can gauge how much effort you need to put into it that is not done here this is just until

3:10 the end then you find out how easy it should have been right um so we played deadline recently now we've played this brett which one do you prefer hard to compare because the one i liked it was deadline wasn't it no obviously no no i mean it's it's hard to compare because i wouldn't even consider it in the same genre right um that isn't so much an investigation uh and deduction as a we're just trying to accomplish these tasks right it's much more of a classic board game style this is more of i mean this feels like something that people who really like mystery novels and people who really like sherlock holmes type stories would would just eat up yeah because you're actually part of the story as it develops in in controlling the action as opposed to just reading the words right it you you actually mentioned it it actually feels kind of like a novel um if you're in the if you're going the right direction you know it feels like who eats a novel um but yeah choose your own adventure it you get the opening case and then it's like okay as detectives where do you want to go well cena the crime is always a good place to start let's go there we did not start with that we did yes we didn't start with cnn nope we got nothing else oh yeah um yes we did and yeah it's it's always something that is you were always invested um even with a story like this where it's like oh the kidnapping oh look we're gonna find we're gonna try and find the girl and it's like oh no that's not the case she

4:42 comes she's the kid she's the kidnappy and she's the one that comes to us and it's like oh okay and then as we because i i was feeling kind of like this is a weird case like that we're on normally it's like oh who killed smithy and it's like oh we gotta find the murderer yeah and there's usually a crime like crime uh items that we need to go to and here we were like no there's no items there's none of that there's no there's an evolution of the series yeah taking a different approach with this box yes perhaps yeah um this one almost feels like it's kind of trying to uh tell the story of the people that work for homes um especially in case one was talking about oh hey they're the bakers through the regulars uh these are the the people who work for home first it's just kind of like the very first box was really holmes and and uh watson yeah and his heroine and his heroine yeah and heroine was mentioned actually not at all that i can think of opioids are that one that was just rampant in the city right so in terms of the like deduction and analyzing what do you what do you guys think frustrating but pleasant yeah very pleasant boy is there some deduction yeah because like as soon as we go into the park you're like let's check out the lodge and i was like i don't see what any of this has to do with anything yeah right and then of course you know we start putting it together but um man there it's not leaps by any means but your brain like your third eye has to be open

6:14 all your chakras have to be aligned like you have to have rubbed all your crystals and stuck them up your butt before you play this game because you have to be on your game right but i mean like sherlock holmes stories you know you've got to be looking for that or agatha christie or any other yeah you gotta be looking for that little thing that was just put out there i mean even i grew up reading encyclopedia brown which you guys have probably never heard i have only i haven't heard of the name but basically simplified version of the same thing yeah the the answer is there but it's just glossed over and you gotta grab it and just go oh that doesn't make sense right like with the cigars like we knew that something was gonna happen with the cigars but we're like what yeah why yeah this is their importance because what's interesting is this is a game unlike chronicles of crime or or detective uh you know all those where you're given a um like a paragraph of something and this is not one of those games that it connects the dots for you right you have to take that paragraph and basically analyze everything about it okay why was this said okay that person didn't want to talk to us why did he not want to talk to us well we immediately think he's guilty or she's guilty and then us detectives immediately are like you go on that trail yeah and that's why i think that this one kind of works uh because there's not so much to like like physically handle like in some of those other games that everyone you can actually play this

7:44 game with more people because it could be me and cats saying oh that person's uh you know guilty because of this reason and you can be like well what about this having having more brains actually helps out a lot more with this one because it's not like everyone's trying to [ __ ] grab cards and read cards and stuff like that yeah you have multiple note takers you have to take notes when you're playing this game otherwise oh yeah might as well just read the book front to back um because it's just it's insane like there was there was something in in i guess some small spoilers for the for the first case which is what we did our run through over there was there was a point in the solution where it was like oh that person didn't want to talk to us it was actually out of guilt not out of suspicion right and uh and it's like oh yeah that sucks because we don't know how he said it um yeah and that's that is that's that's an age of the game uh versus what else has come by because in detective modern crime board game when you in uh when you uh interrogate someone it gives you like a lsl which means low stress level msl medium and hsl for high and so you it the game gives you stuff to go off of oh he says this lsl that must be the truth he wasn't stressed about it says this hi he's lying it gives you something unfortunately just reading from the case book you get none of that you get no inflections you only can go off interpretation

9:17 unless it's specifically said which it does but it doesn't it they don't say anything in there to make you suspicious or delete it out about it right it's just simply factual exactly it's just this here it is or you're missing something and you as as players and readers have to sit there and think uh okay that sounds suspicious he wanted to stay on that on that shift and yeah um but that also goes off of well we didn't have the full picture like we missed every question pretty much every single question yeah and if we had gone the right direction like because even even stuff that were mentioned oh she took regular walks in the park and it's like we never even went there until later like we all were we were so focused on the kidnapping part trying to figure out who it was that we completely went a different path well it was a kidnapping case until until it wasn't at the end when we were told oh by the way this kidnapping has almost nothing to do with it which you and it's hard not to meta because playing these games before it's like okay it's not about the kid now we know it's not going to be about this like but but we still have to find out who did it because at the end of the day someone did do it but why like this is definitely a game where the y is capitalized like capital w h why why yeah because there's always some random like like you said like why did the wiggins gang do it who's the wiggins oh man and that that's so rough so one of my and all of them do it actually but

10:49 you never you never know the questions until until it's over and this one and meet those tales mythos tales is cthulhu but it does the exact same but you have a booklet you have a story you have a directory of a map and stuff like that it's pretty much the exact you even have newspapers it's the exact same thing but the difference between that one is it gives you a uh deadline it's like hey you have 10 leads to get this done right here it's open-ended yeah you could read through the whole book oh like oh okay you can keep going but the game mechanics are well you know sherlock did in a certain number of leads you never know how much so you never want to sit there and do 30 leads yeah because you get a final score and it's like well we know sherlock didn't do it in 30. he probably did it in one oh i went to the scene of the crime and figured it all out i'm wickedly autistic and it's like yeah we know take more heroin so you're dumber uh but i don't know which one i prefer honestly i like the idea of having hey you know because you have a little marker that tracks you know how many leads you've done and it's like by the end of this but once this marker once this marker reaches this marker you have to answer the questions right versus this one where it's up to us when to stop so and just right there that difference that can be critical for people in people's enjoyment the the question the key question is it for which one you prefer is are you

12:19 playing a game to try to accomplish the goal of the game or are you solving a mystery right if you're solving a mystery you know it didn't matter to me how long it took i i could have gone on further i thought i was closer than i was but i didn't know how far the hooks were gonna be having never done this before but but but it is interesting that you know one of them's more of a game this is more of a story evolving in front of you yeah yeah and i think it's interesting is both both mechanics uh you you want your leads to be you you want your leads to matter yeah um and then this one if your lead doesn't matter it doesn't hurt as bad right because it's not it's not a finite number hey we only have 10 leads in this case here we have as many as we want but yeah that's probably gonna be an extra one and they try to compensate for that because some of the cases some of the lead dimensions oh that one's free it doesn't count right and we didn't code any of them but it's kind of like uh yeah it's like oh okay we did go there it didn't pan out but hey that's not minus five points uh but yeah it can definitely be demoralizing because you you when you don't know the questions you never know quite when to stop yeah which can be annoying yeah yeah cause i thought we were much closer than we were right right right and it's like yeah we could have kept going and i mean we would have gotten if we if we went down that path we would have probably ended that how many leads did we end up 14 probably 20 25 leads but we would have we might have gotten those because the four questions were

13:50 25 points each right so it's like okay well maybe we would have gotten the bonus questions um yeah because i believe they are for this for this case the total amount of points is a hundred and twenty thirty forty four hundred and sixty hundred and sixty points and it's not hard and fast with answering sometimes like it's just like oh who did it or or with the bonus questions oh why what was little timmy's sickness and it's like well we kind of think it's this and if you're loosely close i usually always just kind of give it yeah um give us the points some of them are in the ballpark but again that's still the difference between are you playing a game to win or are you solving a mystery right yes which i mean solving a mystery i didn't care about the points i didn't care about how long it took right and we were still so far off and i still enjoyed losing yeah as badly as we did right right it's just and and the good thing about doing it this way it actually more talking about i prefer it this way because at least you can go through the whole book and get the story and meet those tales oh we only have 10 leads we've ran out i guess we don't get to continue like we don't get we get to be told the story at the end here it's just like oh yeah well we did 25 leads and we got we got some of the questions right but then we get the rest of the story or we get holmes's you know here's everything that you missed because you didn't know the right spot yeah uh and so that that still feels good you still get to play the game instead of being like um we only have three more

15:22 leads and actually in that one you could lose leads it's like oh because it's because it's mythical you know there's monsters and it's like oh you get knocked out lose two leads and it's like that's annoying uh none of that happens here like none of them are like this counts for seven leads or something uh cat what do you think about just it in general oh i i mean i like it i still like it i've always liked it um i remember when we first started playing these i definitely sighed i guess if there's a debate on if this is a game or an activity it's more on the activity yeah okay yeah um there's uh there's some like subscription stuff that you can do now about like catch a murderer or anything where you're solving your own mystery and this is definitely like in that same vein that they're trying to emulate and it does it really well it's a i mean pretty much a live-action book reading yeah trying to figure things out it makes me want to you know read sherlock holmes books i remember reading um hounds of baskerville in elementary school it was like the kid version right um just told you immediately who did it

16:39 um but i remember like it's just it's intriguing it keeps you engaged points don't really matter you're doing it to having whose line this is anyway of board games you get a million points but they don't matter right and it's just fun it's fun seeing what everything has to say trying to connect the dots um i always enjoy the note taking part um kind of just table talk throwing out theories whether how right or wrong you and it's a good time yeah right because i mean the theory that we came up with that was still intriguing and actually i liked our theory better than what actually it ended up being it's like wow that's kind of [ __ ] lame we're like this family's a piece of [ __ ] and they're all in on right i was like that's way cooler mom's addict addicted to opioids now with that being said here's where this game definitely shows its ages obviously it's been out for years and all the other games are newer you whenever you find out new information you you as the players have to delineate and connect the dots yourselves in chronicles of crime for example there's an app you scan qr codes and people move around locations and stuff if you go to a location you find like or you talk to a guy who was at that area and he's like oh i didn't see nothing and then you go back to the search area and then you or you talk to someone else they give you information about that guy in that game you can go back and talk to that guy and ask them about oh well this person [ __ ] said you had this and he'll give you a different response it's progressive it makes sense because you can go back and talk to people like well this person is saying

18:10 this you don't get that here right you you are given a slate like we can't go back like we can't go ask wendy about her relationship with the guy you know uh you just have to kind of speculate and take everything for face value and come up with the story yourselves that's why this game isn't for everyone like there the other ones i believe are still way better because you have that interaction you have that progression that movement that real life atmosphere of hey this makes sense i found a weapon at the scene of the crime that has someone's fingerprints on it i can go talk to that person about whose fingerprints it is um and here you you get you get none of that partly for the time it's in the 1800s versus it being a finite book yeah um but still i think what captivates and and overrides that is the storytelling is the mysticism that we are as the players get to dictate what the story is beside versus the game right slightly hand holding um and and it's just kind of like this still holds up in that genre this isn't one of those words like well those four other games came out we don't need to play this one anymore um yeah do you guys have any negatives on it on it i mean other than just you know it can be uh frustrating like if you're just not ready for this you definitely have to be in a certain mood to play it oh absolutely yeah it's not

19:43 like a jovial you know filler it's not it's not a worthless filler um where it's like hey let's just let's just solve a case real quick yeah this is kind of let's drink wine let's get drunk and solve a case this is like yeah no no put on yeah more like get your violin on your hair put on your thinking caps yeah yeah yeah it's definitely for people who want to deductively raise things out which i happen to be one oh great and and over people who enjoy these kinds of mysteries and kind of get how wait that isn't quite right right and it definitely helps to have people who are because i'm my thinking is so analytical like i need to go to point a to point b and it helps to have people who are like well what if what if point a went to point f and then it went to d and then went back to point b what if all this other stuff and i'm just like i would never thought of that wow that ended up actually leading somewhere you know um i'm a little i guess i'm a little frustrated the starting point is so blank that you just don't have any real good way to to start yeah you pick something randomly hopefully yeah that can be a little frustrating to just be like thrown out into the world i mean yeah you're absolutely right because had we gone to hyde park oh she had a routine she went to hyde park i mean seeing the crime once again is always pretty much the best way to go um because we were able to talk to the it's like oh well let's talk to the trains uh and um

21:13 and then it's like okay well now we kind of got her routine we should have just kind of followed her routine but then it's like there's so many just little different little things in there where it's like oh well if she took regular parks or regular walks in the park she was kidnapped in the city and it's like ah yeah i don't i don't think that way i need the game to tell me that pretty much to help me personally um but that's worth it having multiple people who who think differently it helps like that well you know what why was she yeah she that's if that was her routine every time why was she kidnapped there oh yes good point so maybe something to think about suggestions yeah to create different difficulty levels right and i think that's also kind of what um why sherlock holmes is there yeah like because he's kind of like oh if you get stuck go talk to him i mean well he's 42 nw yeah first because for example if we actually went to him it says do you have circle c f uh j t or z and then that would have given us other stuff um so like circle t if toothy ted sold his products to a chemist the chemist may be able to tell you where to find him so but it's always like i don't want to go though i don't want to go to homes at least not without getting started he's in there just shooting a pair when he's like [ __ ] idiots i had time to do nine vials of heroin however it comes in yeah here is another frustrating thing about this game specifically we did case one we only had one newspaper

22:44 you do more cases you have all the previous cases newspapers and that becomes annoying because you never used i was intimidated yes about digesting that much information yep you almost at that point are like you are newspaper person you are a newspaper guy you do that kind of anyway like you you have a designated notetaker you have a designated reader uh and you have kind of a newspaper person anyone can do the london directory but if that kind of goes in hand with the one finding the stuff although it might have been good to pass those responsibilities around just because more people would have been looking at the paper than just me you might have noticed something i didn't you wouldn't have because i was spot on but right i've only got two pages of information exactly and i think that's why it usually helps because it's like if one person is the one only ever looking at it then they're the ones only ever looking at it like i'm not sitting here taking this from you and then looking at the same thing that you're looking at that's true um but yeah it definitely becomes very overwhelming whenever you're in case 10 and you have 10 newspapers and hopefully by then you're familiar with the right information but because these are one-time plays you're inclined not to just rush through them it's like oh i want to savor these i want to just have them and it's like then you come back and then you're just like oh god there was something about an art gallery in case one and we're on case seven okay how does this connect oh sherlock still did in eight leads and we're on 73 i don't think we're getting a hundred points boys you know but once again like you

24:16 mentioned this and you mentioned the score doesn't [ __ ] matter it's just you just want to at least hope that you kind of got your questions right like that you didn't just waste three hours trying to solve a case and you're just like who aren't even close and that that definitely happens you it's like okay question one who kidnapped we don't even know who they are all right we already failed good thing we're not getting fired um so yeah it's i the good news is is after playing all those new games about that are in this genre i'm i'm glad to say this still holds up it's still fun um and they they keep making them so you have there's four box sets with 10 in it uh one of them is actually the jack the ripper it's a mini series there's four connected cases about the women that he he murdered um and that one i did so long ago i couldn't even remember how how it was done and it's interesting because he was never caught so it's just like well the question isn't going to be who is jack the ripper it could be a they could have their own they have they have based off based off uh their studies they have theories of who it might be is what i remember but it's never like a definition what i mean is this is a work of fiction so that box no it goes off of the actual chapter yeah yeah it is the that's too bad um i'd like to blame somebody uh but i i do remember it being fun but yeah we we were very off at the very end um but yeah uh i

25:49 i'm trying to think of other things but i can't really i can't really think of it i think that's okay um it's a good rich theme so if you literary right if you were to i mean because we've played chronicles of crime and detective modern crime board game where would those two still be above this one for me yeah yeah yeah uh i'm still there i think chronicle's a crime a detective modern crime they go back and forth i think detective monochrome is still my favorite they're actually about to come out with another one following the same mechanics but it's vienna collection which is like in the cold war i believe um but yeah because that one detective modern crime has a website that portal games has created it's just so cool and then chronicles of crimes has the movement in a 3d you have like vr goggles you get to look at the scene of the crime yeah vr glasses uh but this one is very mechanical but it's very well written the cases i think every single case we've done has been radically different but they're all intense i wouldn't say and be like let's do another one you know i'm like i am just so brain burned um so yeah i i think that pretty much covers every uh it covers all of unless you guys have anything else to to mention um positives or negatives no pretty simple straightforward all right cool uh on a scale of one to ten uh brett i'm interested in your ranking um just for playing it

27:21 nine nine for the creative element that went behind it ten wow wow i'm very impressed with with what they put into creating it yes yeah and what's interesting about that is we have done i've done like six of the the very first box i've done the jack the ripper ones i think i did one more that wasn't jack the ripper from that box i've done one from the other one and then now one from this one so i've done 10 total um from four different boxes 30 different uh cases because it's been so long whenever we were going to do the original box i was like i could probably do the first one and would not know um it's like there was one of them the 10 soldier from that one that i was like i remember this one being really cool but i don't remember any of the answers like i couldn't sit there and be like oh i know so over time like you don't have to play 10 and then immediately get rid of it you can take time and like be like like i guarantee you a year or so goes by i'd be like i i don't remember yeah this one yeah in in my head i'd i would like to think oh yeah like it was about tobacco or something no i probably wouldn't remember so but with all of those different cases they have all been radically different some of them it's like i don't really care about this theme right so but like uh one of them i remember is about like a zoo and it's like oh yeah which i remember we did really well on um so you go back and forth on on scoring ones we've gotten over a hundred and then once like this one which is like yeah we got [ __ ] zero i'm gonna cut my wrists after this think thanks sherlock holmes

28:52 uh but wow that is the highest score i think that you've given the game so far awesome cat i'm also gonna give it a nine um for what it is i mean it's fun it still holds up even though games kind of overtook it it's still like a very high ranking like it's like oh well they just barely overtake it or something um i don't have a whole lot more to say like we've already said a whole bunch about it but i mean yeah i'll just give it a straight up night yeah um i think ah yeah i think i'm kind of with you with you guys on on the nine um i was originally sitting around an eight uh because those other games have come out that i i i enjoy much more but this one does other stuff that those don't do this one does kind of it's very open-ended you do have to i sometimes maybe in detective modern crime because that one really feels like it but it is a game you have cards you have movement on a board and stuff uh you you really have to think i think a lot more in these than you do in the other ones because it's all based on your note taking the other ones you have the cards that oh hey you you pulled these ones out so you have all these available in front of you and yeah i mean the fact that after all these years i'm still enamored and we still get to theorize do all that stuff and and read a well-written case uh

30:22 and and you get to look at the map and be like okay we were given nothing where the hell is cursing street it's right here that's where we're starting and you you don't really get that in the other one so uh so yeah i think for it being older it becomes more classic i guess uh which is pretty cool that a game it's like it shows this age but that's a positive for it uh which yeah uh so i'm i'm very impressed this is actually the newest box it came out last year i think 2020 or 2019 no because i didn't go to gen con this is what i bought off their store so it was released last year and the fact that each case has been gripping uh yeah i mean they're doing a hell of a job so yeah let me give it a nine as well so that's our thoughts on sherlock holmes consulting detective let us know what you think of the game in the comments below other than that like comment share and subscribe and have a wonderful whatever time of day it is for you hey everyone thank you for watching i really hope that you enjoyed the video if you would like to see more of my content go ahead and click that subscribe button and the bell to be notified whenever i upload any new content if you feel like supporting the channel you can go ahead and click that patreon link to be taken to my patreon and any help is truly appreciated other than that stick around for any any other run-throughs or reviews or cool top tens or whatever i feel like putting on other than that like comment share and subscribe and have a wonderful whatever time of day it is for you