Sound as a Mechanism and Real-Time Crowdfunding

0:00 Well, I'm going to start today with a softer voice cuz I find when I when I re-listen to these episodes, I don't listen to the whole episode, but I often hear the first few seconds when I'm posting it. I hear myself like shouting into the mic cuz I'm excited to talk to you, but it's so loud. And I want to try to be a little calmer, a little quieter as I lead into it. Maybe my excitement can come out later.

0:19 Or maybe we'll just call this the ASMR version of Welcome to Positively Board Gaming. I'm going to scratch a piece of paper crinkle a piece of paper. And I'm scratching my skin. Hopefully you can hear that. It's very soft. And I'm Mitchell Whitfield softly talking with Jamey Stegmaier. We talk about board games, life, and food. Food cat sounds like this when you eat it.

0:41 I You know, I like this. Again, slightly creepy, but it's kind of fun, too.

0:45 It's on theme with my topic today as you'll soon find out.

0:47 really? Oh my god, that's awesome.

0:49 I also I I turned it down the gain on my mic a little bit, so hopefully that doesn't mess up everything, but if it does, we'll fix it in the future.

0:56 Yeah, we'll fix it in post as they say.

0:57 Yeah, I just it's it's I I When I start videos, I often start out with like, "Hey, I'm Jamey. I'm here to talk about this game. I'm here to talk with Mitchell." And I just realized this, it's almost it's really it's really loud. It's louder than I am in person. I'm not someone who like shouts in real life. So.

1:14 And you know, that's interesting. Okay. And wouldn't it be funny though if people heard this episode

1:19 and said, "Well, what's wrong with Jamey? Is he medicated? Where's the excitement? I miss him yelling in my ear." What if that happened? Then we're going to have to go back to our, you know, "Forget that. We're back, folks." I'm all Decker Cannon and you're all Screamy Jamey. It'll be great. Screamy Jamey. That's so not true, but it's funny. It's like Tiny Jamey. It's fine. How are you? How's your week been? Has it been a chaotic week for you? I know a lot of stuff has been shipped and delivered. Uh all the new Stonemaier releases. I told you in the last episode I was so excited. I got my games 4 days after clicking the button on a Sunday they arrived at my home. I was thrilled. Um I've since ordered more copies for more friends. I'm I'm curious to see how that pans out for them. If they don't get it in 4 days, that's tough luck for them. I got mine. That's awful. I'm only kidding. I just want to make Jamie laugh. So, how has this week been for you?

2:07 As far as I know, it's going along really well. I usually get a check-in from my coworker Joe who stays in touch with fulfillment centers. So, I hear that from him. There there there was a slight delay with Canada due to the wildfires in Canada. Apparently, there are wildfires in Bordeaux now, too. I know you've dealt with wildfires. That's crazy. Yeah.

2:26 I hope people are safe.

2:27 Yeah, me too.

2:28 And uh so, that's going well. I'm also hearing from customers who are getting their games or posting about them on Instagram. It seems that I'm seeing some photos of Duellist and Maelstrom, but Wingspan Pocket is so easy to get to the table that I'm mostly seeing photos of that and I'm excited to see that. I'm glad people are getting it right to the table. That's That's like the biggest compliment I think or one of the biggest compliments that a publisher can get. That someone receives the game and they have it on the table that day or 2 days later. That's That's incredible. Yeah.

2:54 That's exciting.

2:54 these yet or have you have you played these yet?

2:56 but remember, I'm taking Wingspan and I think I'm taking Wingspan Pocket and Origin Story with me to Gen Con. So, both the new expansion well, the new Heroes and Villains and the new game will be played there. Duellist I have to wait for cuz my brother's going to play with me. But yeah, so I haven't gotten to the table yet, but you you know that I will. You know that I will. I'm very excited about it. Thrilled, actually. And my nephew is really thrilled. He's also a big Stonemaier fan. So, uh he's getting his games. He should have them maybe uh sometime next week. So, he's he's really excited to get We got the whole family involved, Jamie. It's like a whole familial operation here. We get many generations excited of people. It's great. It's a good human experience.

3:36 That's wonderful. That's really great. I watched I watched a fun movie last night that kind of takes me back. Might take you back, too. I watched the new He-Man movie, Masters of the Universe.

3:45 was that?

3:46 It was actually I think they did it exactly what they should have done with it. They just they they made it a good action movie, a good fantasy and science fiction movie, but they took a very tongue-in-cheek approach to it in certain ways.

3:58 Love that.

3:59 Like they had, you know, there was a bunch of ridiculous names in the universe. Like He-Man himself, like that is He-Man, that is a crazy name.

4:07 It's redundant, is what it is, but let's go on. Yes, it's clever redundant, yeah.

4:11 And there were lots of names like that, and they they incorporate them in a really clever way, through kind of the innocence of a child naming characters like that. It's It's just built into the movie really well.

4:22 Okay.

4:22 I enjoyed it. Did Do you have any connection with He-Man the universe from as a kid or as a

4:26 Uh that was about I mean, that was about at the point I I might have been right at the cusp of aging out when He-Man came out. Yeah. Uh but still I the toys were awesome, and the universe that that Skeletor and all that that whole universe, correct? So, yes, and I And again, the He-Man I think the He-Man board game Wasn't there a He-Man board game as well? Masters of the Universe There's a Masters of the Universe board game. Yeah. And I think they they they they did a nice homage in that as well, especially with the castle. With Skeletor and all that, which was really really cool. But I like when movies, especially movies that have nostalgia baked in,

5:01 Uh-huh.

5:02 um can laugh at themselves and sort of let you wink a little bit of a wink and a nod. And that's why I was going to tell you, per our many conversations on this podcast, but also the board gaming, um I went back and watched Dungeons & Dragons.

5:14 I did Oh, yeah, that's right. You did mention that.

5:16 told you that, and I There's so much There's so much like tongue-in-cheek, like you said, nostalgia, a wink to the audience when they did the gelatinous cube and the and the mimics and um the beholders and just all the different uh the different classes and the way they react It was It was so fun. And it's one of those movies that as you rewatch it, you'll find more and more little nods and winks to the audience.

5:37 Yeah.

5:37 And I wonder if He-Man is like that, too, if you'll find the same. Although I'm probably more dialed into the D&D universe than I am the He-Man universe, but still I I when movies know their audience and know that it's okay to sort of look almost like break the fourth wall and let people in and say, "Okay, we know we're having fun with this. We want you to have fun with it, too." You know what I mean? Not take yourself so seriously that you can't do that, you know? Yeah.

5:58 And I think Dungeons & Dragons sets perhaps the highest bar

6:01 Oh, yeah, so good.

6:02 a movie to do that in the way they connect nostalgia with gaming to um to fantasy. That's like S-tier. Masters of the Universe is not quite that level, but it

6:11 Right.

6:12 it's good enough. I mean, they they There are many ways they could have messed this up, and it I think they did pretty good. And it brought me back to a quick memory that will connect to my topic later. I cuz I I was of the age um where I was into action figures and the cartoon at the time where that was at its peak. And I have a I I had a flashback from when I was like 4 years old, and I remember my uncle bringing over and giving me, probably for a birthday, a He-Man action figure. And I was very sound sensitive as a kid. I still am, like I don't like fireworks, I don't like really loud noises. As I can As we started off

6:45 This This makes sense with the intro now. The intro was totally making sense to me. Go ahead, yeah.

6:48 And this action figure I had a few other action figures, but this one made a really loud noise, and I remember having to like I just I decided I don't know if I had to, but I went to a different room whenever this noise was activated on this action figure. And I look back, and I kind of wish I'd had a little bit more courage cuz it was just a noise, but um but I just It was one of those those triggers, you know, smells and and tastes and things like that. You remember this is a noise trigger from a He-Man action figure.

7:14 That's really interesting. And it it shows Listen, first of all, self-awareness is a wonderful thing. And to be able to But I'm I'm I'm serious. And to be able to look back and to know yourself and to know those trigger points for you, number one, but to be able to look back and go, "Oh, oh, yeah. That makes sense to me now." And you know, to be able to track these things, it's important, and it's all part of, you know, it's all part of making up like little bits of who we are and who we become later on. Um and I don't want you to think, by the way, that I didn't I had my I loved my action figures. I think I was just at that point out cuz again, we have what? Like a 17-year age gap between the two of us, right? So,

7:47 I'm older. Yeah.

7:48 If you please. You wish. Well, I mean

7:51 You look great for 79. You look amazing. Um So, I mean, just to get if there people out there that remember these toys, again, I know I'm aging myself, but I played with Action Jackson.

8:01 Okay. Okay.

8:03 I remember Action Jackson is his name. Bold adventure is his game. Think of what you want to be then suddenly Action Jackson Action Jack That was the theme song and I had to finish the whole thing cuz that's my weirdness. So, yeah. And then I played with the Big Jim and Big Jim's Kung Fu Studio.

8:21 Okay.

8:21 Yeah. And this You're looking at me like, I've never heard of these toys. You look them up afterwards. Big Jim was awesome. He could karate chop. He could karate chop and he had a Kung Fu Studio that you could completely destroy and then put it back together cuz well, you know, meant to be destroyed. And of course, G.I. Joe Mobile Command Center. That was like, wow. Um So, yeah. So, I did I was way into the the figures and action figures at at that time, but apparently they were very different then. If any of you out there listening or watching have any mem- memories of Action Jackson or Big Jim's Kung Fu Studio or the G.I. Joe Mobile Command Center with life-like hair and scarring on the face, uh yeah, please let me know so I won't feel so old and alone. Um Can I tell you something real quick before we before we get started on other stuff? Cuz something happened and I So, uh Funny thing is, let me start off by saying this didn't upset me. I was intrigued. I giggled and I'm intrigued by it. Not upset at all. That's why I'm bringing it up.

9:12 You didn't address it and I think as a friend you wanted to stay away from it, just leave it alone. And I'm going to tell you why in a minute. So, you know, we we read the comments, right? Comments are overwhelmingly positive on our channel, which is great because it we're kind of about sharing things that we love. We're not about knocking anything, you know, we're not it you know, that's what we're about. Positively Board Gaming, it's in our name. So, uh the comments are usually following suit with that and never an issue. There was one comment and I'm going to I'm going to read the comment cuz it was interesting and I wasn't sure somebody else might have been insulted by it. I was not. I was more intrigued like, "Huh, I wonder what you mean?" So, let me pull out the It was for last week's episode.

9:56 Uh-huh.

9:56 Uh and the comment Okay, the comment was Mitchell,

10:01 it's funny. Based on your criteria, you might be the best co-host while simultaneously the worst. It's a good thing you're a fantastic You remember avoiding this one. You didn't write anything with this one. You left it alone. Which I don't blame you for. Cuz what were you going to say? I mean, it could have gotten like, uh it's not doesn't sound very nice. Not sure what you mean. I heard it in your head like going like, I'm just going to leave this alone. Am I right or you just

10:24 My interpretation of it was that since you are the only co-host I've had that you that even though you are the best, it is also

10:32 Oh, it was going back to that. The best Okay. Okay, while simultaneously the worst. I got you. So, it wasn't even Now, I totally get it. You explained it cuz I was like, "Huh?" Cuz I'm not really qualified, I guess, on the board game side cuz I'm not like the biggest gamer, but I am a gamer. Maybe that's what they meant.

10:47 I don't I don't think this was a judgment. I'm curious about your interpretation, but uh yeah, that I'm 99% sure that's what they were after.

10:52 You're right. I mean, you're right. You they were talking about like me being your only co-host here. I'm simultaneously the best and the worst. You're absolutely right. I am the best and the worst. That's a great comment. I I forgot about the context. See, isn't context everything? Now, I get it. I was thinking, "Well, they're right. I mean, I'm not the most qualified to do this." They're like, "Oh, they were talking about the the joke that we made about being your only co-host." Thank you for that comment. It was awesome. And now I'm going to type, "I get it and you're right. It's the best." Um

11:17 I think I got that reference cuz I when on my recent trip to Ireland, I threw a very lucky but very amazing disc golf shot that almost an ace and I shared it with my disc golf group and I was like, I I'm my joke was um Um, the best shot I've ever um, I've ever made on this course in Dublin. With the joke being, I've never been to Dublin before, so

11:36 Right.

11:39 And so someone commented, they were like, "Jamie, great shot, great shot. Just want to point out that it's also your worst shot that you've ever made on that master." That is also true. That's very fair. That's the reference point.

11:49 You're absolutely right. No, I As soon as you said it, I was like, "Oh, I'm such an idiot." We made that I forgot about the reference we made cuz listen, we record these sometimes we record, I think within like a 7-day period we had three different episodes that we record record. Or an 8-day episode to be eight day span, we had three episodes that we did. So I'd forgotten It's Let's blame it on the senior brain. Let's blame it on the senior brain. Jamie, save my senior self. Um, what would you like to chat about this week? I'm interested in hearing. I'm interested in you, and I'm interested quietly.

12:17 Well, quietly is a nice cue for this, nice segue because on a recent episode we talked about sound and noise as a gameplay or a mechanism mechanical element in games. And I I really like that little piece that we talked about, and so I brought it up on a recent live cast. I asked people, "Hey, what what are some other games that um, that use sound or or noise as a mechanism?"

12:38 Okay.

12:39 a few that I haven't played, um, including Coyote, Stop Thief, Hitster, Echoes, and a game called Rhyme. But they also mentioned something that I have played, so I thought I'd bring up a few of them today.

12:49 Okay.

12:49 Um, let me

12:50 I know I know one of them, but that's Yeah, go

12:51 You know them all? Okay.

12:52 I I maybe one at least at least, yeah.

12:54 One? I'll say them all at first, and then and then you can let me know which ones of these you've played and we might talk a little bit more on those. Um, and then I'll I'll I'll explain after I do this list how they use sound. Mysterium Kids, Magic Maze, Nemesis, Clank, Escape the Curse Temple. I think there's a few different Escapes, but it's Temple and Return to Dark Tower. Which of those have you played or are familiar with?

13:18 Nemesis, Return to Dark Tower played, familiar with most of the others, especially Clank which I've been dying to play.

13:25 Yeah.

13:26 Um, which I've been dying to play, and I have like three different versions of it, too. Strange that I wouldn't play them, but I have three versions of it. I have them all. Um, but yeah, I played two and those are those are great choices. There was one the one that I thought you were going to mention was not there. Um, doesn't doesn't Zombicide have a built-in

13:43 Oh, it it probably does. I have not played Zombicide, so yeah.

13:46 I think if I'm not I'm sure people correct me in the comments, but I think Zombicide has a sound mechanism built built-in as well where you have to be quiet or you're going to attract the group, I think. Um, but it's I may be mixing it up in like again the senior brain with Nemesis, which I which I know has that. Um, but yeah, those are that's that's a lot of fun and it's not something I before I played a game that had that mechanism. It's not something I ever would have thought of. That's why that's why I appreciate so much what you do and what other designers do or they come up with things like who would have thought of that's what a great thing to come up with being careful and especially because you're not necessarily simulating the sound something you can hear at the table, but a card that represents that or a token that represents that and something that has to be monitored and watched. It's like an extra thing that you have to be aware of in a game and it's I think when you think of board games it's not a mechanism that would instantly come to mind, but it's so smart such a smart thing to add to a game.

14:41 And I agree like with Nemesis and Clank those are the two where sound it noise isn't actually heard by players in the game. It is a it is a mechanism. You are making noise in Nemesis or trying not to make noise because you'll attract the aliens to you. In Clank you're trying not to make noise as you creep through a dungeon because you don't want the dragon to find out that you're there. And they're they use tokens. One uses bag building that's Clank. The other uses just kind of noise to I think it's tokens. Maybe it's cards in Nemesis. It's been a little while.

15:08 Right, right.

15:09 Um, but I really like that. Um, but and this came up when we were talking about uh, sound direction in the movie The Odyssey. And so I was thinking also what games use sound for a purpose in the game. And uh, Magic Maze

15:23 Okay.

15:23 is a cooperative game where each player is silently moving around a character uh in different directions uh at different times. They're kind of independently doing this. And noise is like silent the game is silent completely silent except if you really need to get someone's attention to do something and to kind of pay attention to something maybe they're forgetting to move a character. It has this big I believe it's red a big red token big red wooden token and you kind of take it on the table and you're like you tap it on the table really loud like you you it's the only noise the completely silent room and you're like making this really loud and it doesn't have to be loud but you usually it it is a it's a little annoying when someone does it but then when someone does it to you you're like oh shoot I you're right I've been forgetting to move by this this character in a certain one direction I'm the only person that can move it north so I need to move it north.

16:15 That's great.

16:16 Um yeah that's a neat one and then Mysterium Kids perhaps the most unique one here

16:21 Okay.

16:22 is so Mysterium is is a game where one player is a ghost and they're trying to convey in Mysterium or Mysterium Park convey through visual clues um how to solve this mystery. But in Mysterium Kids you have the ghost has a drum like a an actual drum comes in the game a little drum it's I would say it's about 8 inches wide.

16:44 Oh that's awesome.

16:46 And they [snorts] all the clues in the game are somewhat related to a drum like there's a train card and there's a a heartbeat card all these so they're visual clues but you have to use the drum to convey a heartbeat or a train to convey these clues to them. I was I wasn't very good at it I'm not I'm not musically inclined but I thought it was so clever to have a player using a drum to clue other players into different to look at different cards. Yeah.

17:12 That is really really cool and you know And mind is like as you're I'm like if you're watching my face and listening to Jamie, if you can't if you if you can't see my face and you're just listening, I'm sort of nodding and thinking at the same time cuz my head is swimming with different things as he's telling me, I'm taking that in but I'm also thinking of other ways these things could be used in other games that use sound a little bit differently. Nemesis in for example, sound can be weaponized because again, depending on what your objective is, it might be to screw over other players you want to get out or you want to eject somebody from the So, depending on that, you might want to use sound to lure the big bad to one of your teammates. So, under the guise of whoopsie, didn't mean to do that, you know, so you can weaponize sound in different ways in different games.

17:58 Um,

17:58 That's what the game does. It does that too. Yeah, I have played Nemesis but all the others does the same thing where you try to get a guard to notice something that is away from you on the right Yeah, yeah.

18:08 I forgot about the burger I forgot about the burger brothers. That's great.

18:10 Burger brothers, yeah, yeah.

18:10 That's another one. That's a great game. Yeah, yeah. Those are that is really cool and it's something Again, it's something I think the average person {slash} gamer doesn't think about but what a brilliant thing and I'm sure there are other ways to use sound. We've only talked you know, scratched the surface here with the games you're talking about but like you said, somewhere we have a drum and there are some there are some games I remember that had a clicker. Like a you know, one of those things with like a like a metal It's actually a quite a disruptive That sound actually would trigger me a little bit too. It's just like very like it it just hits some sometimes it's a kind of sound depending on the register where it hits where you're just like, "Ah, I don't know why but I just don't like it." The clicker was one for me. It was just like that it would it cut through anything. There were some clicker games and I think those are more for like game show type games. Um, where they would you know, like they click yourself in is that but how would they know it was you? Yeah.

19:01 I'll ask you with soundtracks too that use the soundtrack. Escape is one that does that. Escape from Curse Temple where you are I think it's usually on a you you have 10 minutes cooperatively to run through a dungeon. Another dungeon running game. And the soundtrack is playing and whenever a gong sounds, you have 30 seconds to like get back to a certain space. I think you have to get back to the entrance. All players have to get back to the and you're like rolling dice frantically to get back there and then another a door a door I think it's a door opening sound will signal players that that they've that they've made it or they haven't made it and then they can go back into the the dungeon.

19:36 Okay, I'm stressed out cuz you I'm stressed out like thinking about that.

19:39 game, yeah. That's the sound effect.

19:41 Yeah, I don't know I don't know what I don't know how that would how that would hit with me. It sounds super cool.

19:46 Uh-huh.

19:46 But it sounds like I'd be stressed out playing it. Like it's like musical chairs in a dungeon. It's like I got to get me out. You know, and then you have no seat and then you're gobbled. So that's not good. But that that is super cool. What a great topic. And now I'm I'm going to be thinking about this over the weekend and probably just when we talk or when we do our next episode I'll be like, "Hey, I thought of another couple of games that use sound."

20:04 Okay, yeah.

20:06 But are there other games? I mean I mean in Nemesis you can weaponize the sound, can't you? You can use it as a lure, right? You can use it as a lure. Um and I'm trying to think like there there are other games that hit similarly. I'm trying to think what they are. I don't know, it'll come to me. But this is like I said, this is one that's going to sit with me. And over the next few days I'll be like, "Ooh." And I'm going to sit down email Jamie like a list of little games that make noise that make me happy. So there you go.

20:29 Well, I'll list all these games in the description along with the ones that I haven't played. So if anyone thinks of another game that uses sound in any of these variety of ways, let us know.

20:36 Love that. Love that.

20:38 What's what's what's been on your mind this week?

20:39 Well, Jamie, we've talked about this episode before. Hold on, I'm going to need a little drinky-poo. With my lovely still cold after 14 days of ice. It's still there.

20:50 I refreshed last night, so that's stagnant though. We've talked about doing this. We talked about it a couple weeks ago. And uh we're going to do it right now. Jamie, I'd like you to go to your web browser right now if you can.

21:03 Okay.

21:04 And I'd like you to go to gamefound.com because yes, Jamie, let's play the game. Mitchell is going to pledge a game today.

21:11 Oh, it's happening.

21:13 It's happening.

21:13 That's exciting. Okay.

21:15 to help me find a game that you think will hit with me.

21:19 Okay.

21:19 Um or that you think sort of suits my taste cuz you know my taste pretty well as well as anyone. We talk about a lot of games together. And I tend to there there are several that I've talked about multiple times. Um I'm trying to think I the way that I set it up I just made one click. So, let me This is By the way, if any of you are on the fence about getting an ultra-wide monitor, like 34-in uh 40 40-in or 42-in, if you have the space, do it. Don't even think about it because it the the the landscape that it gives you to work like I have the I have the chat with Jamie going on the left and I'll have the browser open on the right looking at what I'm talking about. I'll still be able to see the camera. And yes, my hair is look a little better today. Last episode was a nightmare. Uh so, let me go to search for projects. Gamefound. So, what I did was let me go back and I'll tell you what I did. I'm going I'm going to go back to the main page.

22:09 And I just went to I think did I just go to crowdfunding? I think I just went to crowdfunding and it automatically shows projects. And then it shows 49 results. Are you looking at the same thing?

22:23 I could look at that if you want. I'm also trying to pull up the the projects that I'm following in case that

22:27 Oh, okay. Yeah, that would definitely help the conversation a lot, actually.

22:31 Yeah. Yeah, I think Okay, followed. Here we go. Okay.

22:35 So, Jamie and I, if you're listening or watching, Jamie and I talked about several episodes ago like what wouldn't it be fun if if in real time I found a game for myself and I, you know, I pledge that game and I became part of the process and it's something I can obsess over for the next year or 6 months, a year or 2 years, depending on how long it takes to come out. Which sometimes does come into play, Jamie. I do look and see when the release is.

22:59 Right.

23:00 Cuz sometimes the excitement of oh, knowing it's coming out in under a year, which sounds ridiculously long if you're not accustomed to what it's like in the world of, you know, crowdfunding. Um, under a year is very exciting. Uh, year and a half is normal and then having having to postpone because of production issues or design issues, that comes up, that's natural. So, you have to know, if you were doing this a lot either along with us or decide to do crowdfunding board games, it's a great way to get games, but also know you have to have I think if the expectations are measured there'll be less room for disappointment knowing oh, it could take 6 months to a year after the date they say it might take and it's not because they're not trying, it's because stuff happens. Stuff out of their control, stuff out of different parties' control. So, yeah. Is that a good like caveat to give people, Jamie? I mean

23:44 a fair caveat, yeah.

23:46 Um, the page that I'm on right now, right out there are things that are jumping out at me right away.

23:52 Okay.

23:52 Right away.

23:53 What's jumping out at you?

23:53 Uh, what I'm seeing Justice League Unlimited the role-playing game.

23:57 I see that as well.

23:59 This has 20 This must have just started. It must have funded super quickly because it already has over $400,000 in funding. Oh, the goal was reached in 14 minutes. Okay, that makes sense. And basically it's taking the Justice League Unlimited universe and converting it into a tabletop RPG.

24:17 Yeah.

24:17 Uh, live your ultimate superhero dream with the Justice League Unlimited RPG. Fight alongside Batman, Superman, Wonder Woman. Yes, please. Or play as the icons themselves. Join the world's greatest superhero team and save the DC universe. I love this. By the way, I love the Marvel universe as well and I think people sometimes take the DC universe for granted. It's like oh, Marvel, Marvel, but, you know, heroes like Batman, Superman, so many great comics, movies, TV shows, uh, even like Green Arrow. There's going to be Did you see there's a new Green Lantern series coming? That looks great. I saw the trailer.

24:50 yeah.

24:50 It looks like so much fun. So, I mean, first of all, from your point of view in terms of RPGs,

24:56 Mhm.

24:56 I know you're not a huge tabletop RPG guy.

24:59 I know very little about them, yeah.

25:01 But, how does the idea of mixing the DC Universe Justice League into an RPG system where you can play as or alongside, how does that strike you?

25:12 I mean, it sounds incredible. The The The concept of it sounds incredible.

25:16 Right.

25:17 I think my my maybe my biggest question for you is um Oh, part of it is what are you hoping to get out of the game? I.e., are you happy just if this is just on your shelf as a book that you look through and like think about it? Cuz I think a lot of people do that with RPGs. Or

25:30 I tend to feel that

25:31 something that that's important for you to actually play, do you think you would play this or do you already have too many RPG opportunities that aren't this that that were that are more likely to happen?

25:39 That's a great question. The answer is yes and yes. I already have too many. I already have too many, but I think I would play this. I'd love to have the books. I'd love to have the books. I'd love to have the system in hand. I like sometimes just the idea of like knowing that I'll have the opportunity to do this. And so much love and attention is put into not just the system, but the illustration. And you know, all the all the stuff all the different books that go along I'm looking like what goes along with it. So, you have the books and then there's there I guess the all-in is 320. That's a lot. But, that's also getting That's also I think getting some miniatures and getting the bags with the the extra campaign. Oh, the the dungeon sheet the the DM shield looks really cool. The uh the screen. What do they call it? The DM DM screen or the GM screen? Um so, people can hide what they're doing. And they have There's I guess the local hero core books.

26:29 Uh if you get the core book system, it looks like it's about $99. And then if you get more of the Teen Titans with the slipcase and a little bit more deluxe-ification, it's about $159. Okay, this is definitely something I'm interested in. So, let's put that on hold. And do you see anything if you're you're looking at your screen right now, too? I have a feeling I know where you're going to go right now. But, uh does something catch your eye?

26:51 to a certain extent. I'm looking at Lord of the Rings Ascension.

26:54 Thank you very much. I was I was waiting for that. Um So, yeah, Ascension.

27:00 Ascension? Have you played any of

27:01 not. Have you played Ascension?

27:02 I have, yeah. It's a It's uh uh it's a great um deck-building game. It's a deck-building game that introduced the idea of a card row instead of a bunch of piles of preset cards like in Dominion. So, a a card river.

27:16 Oh, so this was the this is the originator of that concept.

27:18 of it. Yeah, as far as I know.

27:19 I love that. I love that and it's set in the Lord of the Rings universe, which is for me it's like since I haven't played the original, if I were to dive in

27:28 Yeah.

27:29 Lord of the Rings for me would be a fantastic way to dive in because I already have an affinity for that universe. I really really love it. Um Wow, it's already over well.

27:37 the Rings you're looking at here, so

27:39 Okay, yeah, yeah.

27:39 the whole trilogy it's 150. And if you just want the Fellowship it's 60.

27:45 Well, that does make the whole thing seem like a better deal. I'm just wondering it's a Okay, so it comes Oh, wow, and then they have a deluxe saga collection. All three standalone games a beautiful leather bound do not need that. I know I'm a sucker for deluxe-ification. I do not need that. I'm looking at more info for each one. So, you're right. I think each of them individually go for $60. I have a feeling and again, I mean we know I do have a little bit of a completionist in me. This isn't a secret. Jamie, I'm I can own that. I can own the completionist in me.

28:13 Yeah.

28:14 But if I was going to get this the idea of only having one part of the story doesn't seem right. That doesn't sit well with me for some reason. And it does it's not because oh, I have to have all of it I have to have all of it. It's just the idea of it. It's like if you're going to get the Lord of the Rings

28:27 Uh-huh.

28:28 get the saga. I don't have to get the Hobbit saga as well, but if I'm in Lord of the Rings, I feel like I should get the Lord of the Rings. You know, I I don't want the I don't want the I don't

28:36 people agree with you. Around three 3,000 people have backed the trilogy while only around 200 people have backed just the Fellowship. So, I think that is a a comment a a reasonable sentiment.

28:47 This is a really strong contender right now. You really Yeah, this This tickles my fancy. You know what tickling sounds like on a piece of paper? Well, go ahead.

28:54 Yeah, I agree. The only slight surprise to me is that it doesn't deliver, and it was an estimate, it could be better, could also be worse, is December 2027. Which is a little surprising for me for a game

29:06 For a card-based game?

29:08 Well, not not the card-based part of it, but the that Ascension already exists. Like, they're not reinventing the system. Um it says it Maybe that's just because the whole trilogy they want to ship it all at once, and and the whole doing the whole trilogy is a lot of work, which I understand.

29:22 Right, right. So, I mean, you know, there's a good It It seems by this And And listen, again, you're using your designer and your gamer mind together, which is wonderful. That's a That's a luxury I don't have, but I glean a lot of information from you, and I learn a lot of stuff from you. So, if there if you're looking at a game that on the surface, in terms of production value, which is could equally consume time and cause things to be delayed as design can. Um If you're looking at a game that has like a low threshold in terms of components and what it what you need to produce the game, then you almost have to look on the other side and say, "Okay, it's got to be They're not finished with the design." Which is okay, cuz like you said, this is a universe that is vast and has a lot of eyeballs on it, and you want to get it right. So, for the I mean, that's another reason. I mean, this is a franchise that you want to get it right.

30:11 That you'd rather err on the side of caution and put more time because this is something that people will micro micromanage and dissect. Like, "Wait a minute, he and her Gandalf was he was the white was he wasn't that the And you have to make sure everything's right. Um

30:23 Yeah.

30:24 So, I don't I almost don't mind. I think something like this would be worth waiting for, and knowing, you know, knowing it's it could be Why have other games coming in, Jamie? I could be more mature about this. I could be more mature about it while I scratch my skin. Can you hear that?

30:35 Sure you can.

30:37 We're back to this. Yeah. Okay, so that's Maybe Maybe look What do you think? Should we look at one more, and then make a decision?

30:43 more. Okay, should we find one that isn't an intellectual property just to have a non-IP game in the mix unless your third one is an IP game.

30:51 No. I I want to hear what you have to say. I want to mean I mean I I saw when they there's a reprint of Shiver Me Timbers which I don't have.

31:00 Okay.

31:00 Um and I love pirate games.

31:03 Yeah.

31:04 But um I don't know. I mean I'm kind of open. What what are you thinking?

31:08 Hm, I see a couple contenders. I'll throw out a few of them here. See The Elder Scrolls, which is I believe it's mostly a solo game with a lot of custom dice. It's probably going to be expensive, but and I'm looking at the uh the the ranking list here. What I I think this is funding today. Some of these might be campaigns that have ended but are still collecting

31:26 Right, right, right.

31:27 I also see KeyForge, which is a really great two-player game. And I see Galileo's Truth, which jumps out to me a little bit because Thunder Gryph is a fantastic company and they've now partnered with Awaken Realms, which is also a great company. So that combination um I have a feeling it's going to be a very strong Euro game, like a medium-heavy Euro game. And now I'm talking to you.

31:52 That that the Galileo's Truth actually does tickle my fancy and I do like both companies who are involved. I know. Board Game Geek anyone. Darwin's Journey and these this isn't these are not light games. These are not light games. These are These are medium to high weight, correct? In terms of the weight of the game?

32:10 That's correct. Yeah, so if you already you probably already have a lot of games that fill that that slot. But but this I I'm fairly confident it will be a very good game within that

32:21 that looks good. That and while you were saying that, you know, you brought up um The Elder Scrolls.

32:29 Yes.

32:29 And I do I think that's an expansion for a game I actually have.

32:33 Oh, okay.

32:34 Was it Heroes of Tamriel? Is is the one you were looking at? It must It must be Heroes of Tamriel cuz I think that's an expansion.

32:40 Yes, that's right.

32:41 By Chip Theory Games. No, that Yeah, this is not their single player. It's not part of their um God, what is the What are the What is the dice game that I played? Do you No, yeah, this Yeah, Too Many Bones. This is based on the Too Many Bones system.

32:53 Yeah, you also have the uh 20 20 Strong.

32:57 20 Strong. I did it right this once this episode. Oh, yeah, 20 Strong. That's right. So, this is not part of that. Um this is part of The Elder Scrolls, which is the the Elder Scrolls version of Too Many Bones, I think, the adventure game.

33:12 Yes.

33:12 Uh it's an adventure game using that The Elder Scrolls universe, which is wonderful. Um

33:17 Right.

33:18 And I'm trying to think, what is this add? Does this add if Which we talked about like just adding more of the stuff you like to games? And I'm wondering if this is similar or if it's just different adventures. Uh is it really saying here? Cuz I like when they tell you right on top. In between now if you Okay, welcome to the pledge Oh, it's a pledge manager. That's why it's not showing. I have to go I'd have to go back to the original campaign to get all the information. Cuz this is just a pledge manager right here, right?

33:43 Yeah, and it does say that the pledge manager will be open until at least June I It says at least June. We're in July right now as we're recording. It's gone a little bit late, which is fine.

33:53 You know what? I think I'm going to show some growth.

33:56 Okay.

33:56 to show some growth here, and I'm going to stay away from this one because there's so much that I have for the original game

34:02 Yeah.

34:02 that I've yet to explore that I I have I don't deserve this yet.

34:07 Okay.

34:08 I don't deserve this yet. Um so, that brings us back to

34:13 So, we have a a deck-building game based on The Lord of the Rings. We have a role-playing game based on DC, and we have a uh uh probably a medium-heavy Euro game with beautiful components from Awaken Realms and Thunder Graph. Do you want to try to eliminate one of the three? Or how do you want to do this? Or just pick one of them.

34:32 Let

34:32 Let's let's let's eliminate for now Galileo's Truth because

34:35 Okay. Okay.

34:36 It's scaring me a little bit. It looks a little heavier than I'm used to, which is not a bad thing.

34:40 Yeah.

34:40 But let's eliminate that for now.

34:43 Okay.

34:43 And let's look at Justice League and Ascension. So, I'm very intrigued by the RPG. That I love that and I love like you said, I love having the books.

34:52 Yeah.

34:52 But you know, I've talked a lot about deck building recently.

34:55 Yeah.

34:55 And how, you know, I've just the more I play, the more I love. The fact that I haven't played Ascension, but that I can jump in at this level to Lord of the Rings. Jamie, I think I have to.

35:09 I support that decision. I I think you're I know that Ascension is fun and I think they're going to do some cool things for Lord of the Rings for this. Um it's it is a bit of a wait, but that means they're going to do it right. So.

35:22 Okay, you know what? Let's I'm I'm I'm clicking on back this project right now.

35:27 It's happening. It's happening.

35:29 Select this reward, the trilogy bundle.

35:33 I said you're going to read out your credit card real quick while you do this.

35:36 It's so many other people can join us on this journey.

35:41 Uh pledge summary, pledge is individual, United States currency, pay in full, has my information saved. Jamie. I have just done our first live pledge.

35:53 A live pledge. A first.

35:55 Verifying payment. Hold on, it hasn't gone through yet.

35:58 Well.

35:58 There's no other There's no other podcast that I know of right now today at this moment doing this with Lord of the Rings Ascension.

36:07 And I dare you to prove me wrong. No, I'm kidding. I have no idea. But I am Oh my god. I am backer number 4,273.

36:15 All right.

36:16 Them's a lot of backers.

36:18 That is a lot of backers. Well, that's exciting. Yeah, well uh Oh, they even show on the page, they show how many different Ascension sets there have been. There There's a lot that they See, this is what I think is cool about it, too. I'm glad you did this. They They have a lot of mechanisms to pull from to match with the theme of Lord of the Rings. So,

36:37 Yeah. I'm sorry. I didn't mean to interrupt. Go ahead.

36:40 No, go ahead. Go ahead. Yeah.

36:41 No, what I was going to say is that what I love is when I when you dive into a system, a game system like this, and you find that you like it, what what a wonderful thing because you can look back in the catalog and find so many other games that share mechanism, that share rules, that share, you know, that that have a that will automatically be familiar to you. Yeah. And I don't think it's weird to say or out of line to say, "If you like if this, then this. If you like this, you will like Ascension. You will like other games in the Ascension universe." So, Jamie, thank you for helping me make my pick. I'm so excited. Trace is going to be so mad.

37:17 Podcast is not supposed to cost you money. Yes, it is. I beg to differ. No, she's, you know, she she loves that I love this hobby and that I love sharing it with you and all of you listening, thank you. And I want to know from people who are listening or watching,

37:29 Yeah. Yeah.

37:30 is there a game they have recently Did they recently, first of all, have another down to Listen, we can't always get all the things that we want to get. So, did you have a Any of you out there listening, narrow down to a couple of games that you really want to recently and then picked one and maybe why did you pick that one? I'd love to hear that cuz that's something that's kind of cool for me. And Jamie,

37:46 that game happen to include sound or mechanism? Let us know that that in the comments as well or or as that applies to any game.

37:52 See how I said, "And Jamie," and I pointed to you and I was like handing See, that's what That's what people that know each other do. They like they know to hand that baton. God, what a rhythm we have after 289 episodes together. This is wonderful. Thank you for helping me on this journey and I'm excited. Now Now I feel like it's a shared experience. When the game does come out, I can give updates, you know, if it's going to be a little while or maybe they gave themselves extra time and we'll have a happy surprise of a game delivering sooner than expected. So, you never know. And there's always that excitement, but nothing comes close to knowing what Stonemaier does. When you get a game announced, you will have it very soon, and I love that. So, you know, we all we all want things we want right away. Who doesn't? It's natural. It's human. So, well, yeah, this is really fun. I and I appreciate your help. I think I think you helped me choose wisely.

38:40 Well, this was fun, Mitchell. It's good to see you. Good to go through this process with you. I hope to We'll have to do it again. Maybe I'll do one sometime if I'm debating between a few different projects.

38:48 I would love that. We have to do one with you. I don't know that I'm dying to like force you to spend money, but I think this is a lot of fun, and I like the I like the back and forth and sort of what how people think, what what goes into their process of picking game, which is going to be unique to that person. So, it's sort of fun. It lets you learn a little bit more about the person, too. So, I always think that's cool.

39:05 Sounds great.

39:07 All right, Jamie.

39:08 [sighs]

39:08 Have a great weekend.

39:09 You got it. Talk to you soon.

39:11 Bye.